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	<title>Comments on: Hide the Decline II is Back</title>
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	<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/</link>
	<description>Facts, not fiction on climate change</description>
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		<title>By: Justin Campbell</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-3313</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Campbell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 01:46:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-3313</guid>
		<description>how could we ever forget Geri Halliwell of Spice Girls, they were very popular in the 90s..:&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>how could we ever forget Geri Halliwell of Spice Girls, they were very popular in the 90s..:&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-2900</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jul 2010 15:54:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-2900</guid>
		<description>...&quot;Dealing with global warming is a hoax that will financially benefit those who are peretuating the hoax...&quot; The global warming issue, hoax or not (I believe it is a hoax or at the least an extreme exaggeration that we humans are pitifully powerless to affect) has benefited many, many people financially as well as politically. There are other motivations that I won&#039;t go into. Just look at Al Gore&#039;s net worth and tell me that the money he now has was because he invented the internet.

There is some clear thinking on this issue and a lot of bad thinking motivated by hatred, greed, jealousy, arrogance, and fear. Fear is ultimately what is being sold and people are buying it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;&#8221;Dealing with global warming is a hoax that will financially benefit those who are peretuating the hoax&#8230;&#8221; The global warming issue, hoax or not (I believe it is a hoax or at the least an extreme exaggeration that we humans are pitifully powerless to affect) has benefited many, many people financially as well as politically. There are other motivations that I won&#8217;t go into. Just look at Al Gore&#8217;s net worth and tell me that the money he now has was because he invented the internet.</p>
<p>There is some clear thinking on this issue and a lot of bad thinking motivated by hatred, greed, jealousy, arrogance, and fear. Fear is ultimately what is being sold and people are buying it.</p>
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		<title>By: donad</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1807</link>
		<dc:creator>donad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 May 2010 22:39:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1807</guid>
		<description>NO NO NO / what part of NO don&#039;t you understand , You Obumer run the USA off china money Tax us with a new medical bill that will make many unhappy and you still can think of nothing but to destroy the USA , its a now drainer if you really care about something you work on it for FREE and that gos for all in DC if you love the USA and you see the money mess it is in ,If you really had Love action are needed . I have worked on some thing in my life I Love and not got payed . We are watching all of you and we can tell a man or a woman heart buy your words and your actions. Obumer  you do not understand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>NO NO NO / what part of NO don&#8217;t you understand , You Obumer run the USA off china money Tax us with a new medical bill that will make many unhappy and you still can think of nothing but to destroy the USA , its a now drainer if you really care about something you work on it for FREE and that gos for all in DC if you love the USA and you see the money mess it is in ,If you really had Love action are needed . I have worked on some thing in my life I Love and not got payed . We are watching all of you and we can tell a man or a woman heart buy your words and your actions. Obumer  you do not understand.</p>
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		<title>By: Rick</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1718</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 May 2010 17:11:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1718</guid>
		<description>I think we can all agree, we need to be good stewards of this planet.

I like the idea of doing controlled experiments.

What do you think would be the result of a higher concentration of CO2 gas in our atmosphere?  

Here is a very interesting time-lapse video of a small-scale experiment that shows how it might impact plant life:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qVNK6zFgE&amp;feature=player_embedded

I&#039;m sure you all remember what plants &quot;breath&quot; out, when they finish processing the CO2, right?

I believe we should all be responsible in the way we use the earth&#039;s resources. That belief follows logically from my faith in God, the Creator, and the Bible as his inspired word to us. God gave us responsibility for being stewards over the earth. 

What logical reason would someone have for intervening in the warming of the earth if life on earth began accidentally? (By the way, if we are the result of random chance, why is logic even relevant? On the other hand, if we were created by a supremely intelligent God, who set the entire universe in motion and created the marvelous balance we see in nature, then we have a reason to believe in rules of logic.) 

And I&#039;m not worried about the end of the world. It won&#039;t be mankind&#039;s pollution or CO2 that kills it. When man&#039;s time on earth is up and everything that needs to be done here is completed, God will destroy it with fire, and then there will be a new, perfect world.

Meanwhile, we should all apply our God-given intelligence, led by His Spirit, to divide between truth and lies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we can all agree, we need to be good stewards of this planet.</p>
<p>I like the idea of doing controlled experiments.</p>
<p>What do you think would be the result of a higher concentration of CO2 gas in our atmosphere?  </p>
<p>Here is a very interesting time-lapse video of a small-scale experiment that shows how it might impact plant life:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qVNK6zFgE&#038;feature=player_embedded" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qVNK6zFgE&#038;feature=player_embedded</a></p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure you all remember what plants &#8220;breath&#8221; out, when they finish processing the CO2, right?</p>
<p>I believe we should all be responsible in the way we use the earth&#8217;s resources. That belief follows logically from my faith in God, the Creator, and the Bible as his inspired word to us. God gave us responsibility for being stewards over the earth. </p>
<p>What logical reason would someone have for intervening in the warming of the earth if life on earth began accidentally? (By the way, if we are the result of random chance, why is logic even relevant? On the other hand, if we were created by a supremely intelligent God, who set the entire universe in motion and created the marvelous balance we see in nature, then we have a reason to believe in rules of logic.) </p>
<p>And I&#8217;m not worried about the end of the world. It won&#8217;t be mankind&#8217;s pollution or CO2 that kills it. When man&#8217;s time on earth is up and everything that needs to be done here is completed, God will destroy it with fire, and then there will be a new, perfect world.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, we should all apply our God-given intelligence, led by His Spirit, to divide between truth and lies.</p>
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		<title>By: factschecker</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1643</link>
		<dc:creator>factschecker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Apr 2010 01:54:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1643</guid>
		<description>Amazing what people will accept as fact and Science when they want to believe something. 
A fact check of www.oism.org (Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine)  easily shows the bogus information these guys present.  
As with the Discovery Institute&#039;s attempts to put Creationism into Science classrooms once the &quot;science&quot;  is revealed we find it breathtaking in its inanity.  
A few problems pointed out with the OISM paper (there are many more)

1 - all versions of their paper make a mistake in the dating of Keigwinâ€™s Sargasso Sea record by 50 years (figure 1 in this latest version).  This throws off their claim.  
1a - There are many more reasearch papers based upon paleo-records.  Why only this one?  Because they can shift the dates  ? 

2 â€œThe average temperature of the SARGASSO SEA has varied within a range of about 3Â°C during the past 3,000 years.â€
A real scientific summary would look at average temperatures from around the globe not just this one for Sargasso Sea

3 - Real science uses a range of peer work. Such as these studies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png 
    - These guys choose one study in a particular area and mis-use it,  provide no other studies, and more importantly do not do any reasearch of their own.  

You can choose to believe in facts are choose facts to support what you believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amazing what people will accept as fact and Science when they want to believe something.<br />
A fact check of <a href="http://www.oism.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.oism.org</a> (Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine)  easily shows the bogus information these guys present.<br />
As with the Discovery Institute&#8217;s attempts to put Creationism into Science classrooms once the &#8220;science&#8221;  is revealed we find it breathtaking in its inanity.<br />
A few problems pointed out with the OISM paper (there are many more)</p>
<p>1 &#8211; all versions of their paper make a mistake in the dating of Keigwinâ€™s Sargasso Sea record by 50 years (figure 1 in this latest version).  This throws off their claim.<br />
1a &#8211; There are many more reasearch papers based upon paleo-records.  Why only this one?  Because they can shift the dates  ? </p>
<p>2 â€œThe average temperature of the SARGASSO SEA has varied within a range of about 3Â°C during the past 3,000 years.â€<br />
A real scientific summary would look at average temperatures from around the globe not just this one for Sargasso Sea</p>
<p>3 &#8211; Real science uses a range of peer work. Such as these studies: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png</a><br />
    &#8211; These guys choose one study in a particular area and mis-use it,  provide no other studies, and more importantly do not do any reasearch of their own.  </p>
<p>You can choose to believe in facts are choose facts to support what you believe.</p>
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		<title>By: TiredofReading</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1626</link>
		<dc:creator>TiredofReading</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 16:38:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1626</guid>
		<description>Been reading these comments. Obvious Rambo is a paid to comment on this site. He&#039;s posting every 37 seconds. It&#039;s been a waste of my time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Been reading these comments. Obvious Rambo is a paid to comment on this site. He&#8217;s posting every 37 seconds. It&#8217;s been a waste of my time.</p>
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		<title>By: Al</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1624</link>
		<dc:creator>Al</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 15:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1624</guid>
		<description>Exactly Holly, it&#039;s all about control. If you have the opportunity see FLOW [For the Love of Water], it sums up this in a microcosm. Industry wants to make money off of everyone. Part of the IMF and World Banks (along with the corporations, because as we all know, the private banking industry is the pinacle of the corporate system) policy of EPP [Every-Person-Pays]. What Cap and Trade will do, is deny the poorest of the poor heat, shelter, and sustenance by raising the price of all these things. All the right/left paradigm does is divide and conquer us. As long as we are divided arguing over the minutiae, the corporations are stealing our basic rights to liberty. We have forgotten, that the basic premise of our Declaration of Independence was to make us sovereigns; and to institute governments among us to serve as our servants, not our masters. Corporations have set themselves over us, we must take back from them, what we have allowed them to slowly steal away from us and the world through stealth and subterfuge. This isn&#039;t about Cap and Trade and the altuism of the world&#039;s elite ie Al Gore, Godlman Sachs, (let us not forget Ken Ley of Enron helped to formulate this whole scheme), and all the rest of the fake Greenies Bill Gates, Ted Turner (who owns more private land than anyone else on earth), etc., if you truly read into what they want is a worldwide eugenics program to eliminate what Henry Kissinger refers to as &quot;useless eaters&quot;...that meaning, you and I, along with the third world. Their aim is to be the elites in a scientific socialist dictatorship, limiting the slave population to (see Georgia Guidestones). You can&#039;t make this stuff up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly Holly, it&#8217;s all about control. If you have the opportunity see FLOW [For the Love of Water], it sums up this in a microcosm. Industry wants to make money off of everyone. Part of the IMF and World Banks (along with the corporations, because as we all know, the private banking industry is the pinacle of the corporate system) policy of EPP [Every-Person-Pays]. What Cap and Trade will do, is deny the poorest of the poor heat, shelter, and sustenance by raising the price of all these things. All the right/left paradigm does is divide and conquer us. As long as we are divided arguing over the minutiae, the corporations are stealing our basic rights to liberty. We have forgotten, that the basic premise of our Declaration of Independence was to make us sovereigns; and to institute governments among us to serve as our servants, not our masters. Corporations have set themselves over us, we must take back from them, what we have allowed them to slowly steal away from us and the world through stealth and subterfuge. This isn&#8217;t about Cap and Trade and the altuism of the world&#8217;s elite ie Al Gore, Godlman Sachs, (let us not forget Ken Ley of Enron helped to formulate this whole scheme), and all the rest of the fake Greenies Bill Gates, Ted Turner (who owns more private land than anyone else on earth), etc., if you truly read into what they want is a worldwide eugenics program to eliminate what Henry Kissinger refers to as &#8220;useless eaters&#8221;&#8230;that meaning, you and I, along with the third world. Their aim is to be the elites in a scientific socialist dictatorship, limiting the slave population to (see Georgia Guidestones). You can&#8217;t make this stuff up.</p>
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		<title>By: Rambo</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1615</link>
		<dc:creator>Rambo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 05:49:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1615</guid>
		<description>David, 

Thanks for the comment.  I&#039;m not &quot;that&quot; old, but I am aware of the skeptics argument that the &quot;same&quot; scientists blew it once before so they are obviously messing up again.  In reality, that isn&#039;t true.  

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/01/the-global-cooling-myth/

Notice how the arguments are made.  They have quotes and citations which I have verified.  

CO2 is not poison, I never said it was.  The impact of CO2 on the environment certainly could have a negative effect.  Kind of like taking too much vitamin D.  It isn&#039;t a poison, but too much is harmful to the body.  

You manipulation of the data is almost comical.  I hear anti-GW advocates play both sides.  I hear the climate has been cooling for a decade (that is manipulation of data) and I hear climate is way too complex to predict in the long term.  Both are true, but have really nothing to do with the price of tea in China.

As for my agenda, it is a better future for my kids.  I work, pay a lot of money in taxes, and support my family.  I&#039;m not for cap and trade.  I for applying a direct tax on all fossil fuels.  Tax the living daylights out of them.  It will be painful at first, but once the costs of using fossil fuels exceed those of other sources, companies will invest in more research to optimize other fuel sources.  However, as long as we continue to have relatively cheap fossil fuels, we will continue to fund terrorism and potentially negatively impact the environment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David, </p>
<p>Thanks for the comment.  I&#8217;m not &#8220;that&#8221; old, but I am aware of the skeptics argument that the &#8220;same&#8221; scientists blew it once before so they are obviously messing up again.  In reality, that isn&#8217;t true.  </p>
<p><a href="http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/01/the-global-cooling-myth/" rel="nofollow">http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/01/the-global-cooling-myth/</a></p>
<p>Notice how the arguments are made.  They have quotes and citations which I have verified.  </p>
<p>CO2 is not poison, I never said it was.  The impact of CO2 on the environment certainly could have a negative effect.  Kind of like taking too much vitamin D.  It isn&#8217;t a poison, but too much is harmful to the body.  </p>
<p>You manipulation of the data is almost comical.  I hear anti-GW advocates play both sides.  I hear the climate has been cooling for a decade (that is manipulation of data) and I hear climate is way too complex to predict in the long term.  Both are true, but have really nothing to do with the price of tea in China.</p>
<p>As for my agenda, it is a better future for my kids.  I work, pay a lot of money in taxes, and support my family.  I&#8217;m not for cap and trade.  I for applying a direct tax on all fossil fuels.  Tax the living daylights out of them.  It will be painful at first, but once the costs of using fossil fuels exceed those of other sources, companies will invest in more research to optimize other fuel sources.  However, as long as we continue to have relatively cheap fossil fuels, we will continue to fund terrorism and potentially negatively impact the environment.</p>
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		<title>By: Rambo</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1613</link>
		<dc:creator>Rambo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 05:36:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1613</guid>
		<description>Chip,

Religion can not be proven or disproved and does not belong in this debate.  For example, who is right, Jesus or Allah?  Politics is based on ideology and really not worth my time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chip,</p>
<p>Religion can not be proven or disproved and does not belong in this debate.  For example, who is right, Jesus or Allah?  Politics is based on ideology and really not worth my time.</p>
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		<title>By: Rambo</title>
		<link>http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/2010/04/hide-the-decline-ii-is-back/comment-page-1/#comment-1612</link>
		<dc:creator>Rambo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Apr 2010 05:34:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.NoCapAndTrade.com/?p=388#comment-1612</guid>
		<description>Brian, 

I apologize.  It is hard to tell sometimes.  By young, I didn&#039;t mean 15, I meant 20s (college student).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brian, </p>
<p>I apologize.  It is hard to tell sometimes.  By young, I didn&#8217;t mean 15, I meant 20s (college student).</p>
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