We have successfully reactivated our new version of ‘Hide the Decline’ on YouTube after it was removed earlier this week, citing bogus reasons. Learn more about the controversy involving the video and Dr. Michael Mann by clicking here. Be sure to also check-out our documentary Chicken Little Goes To Washington.
|
120 Responses to “Hide the Decline II is Back”
Leave a Reply
|
Entries (RSS)
Well, that video was as lame as the politics behind it.
Not sure which “lame” politics you are referring to bone-a-potamus, but the question of “global warming” has certainly not been settled. Below is the link to a report sent to Pres BO along with a petition signed 31,478 Scientists who believe Al Gore’s claims about global warming are based on bad science. http://www.oism.org/pproject/GWReview_OISM600.pdf
Amazing what people will accept as fact and Science when they want to believe something.
A fact check of http://www.oism.org (Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine) easily shows the bogus information these guys present.
As with the Discovery Institute’s attempts to put Creationism into Science classrooms once the “science” is revealed we find it breathtaking in its inanity.
A few problems pointed out with the OISM paper (there are many more)
1 – all versions of their paper make a mistake in the dating of Keigwin’s Sargasso Sea record by 50 years (figure 1 in this latest version). This throws off their claim.
1a – There are many more reasearch papers based upon paleo-records. Why only this one? Because they can shift the dates ?
2 “The average temperature of the SARGASSO SEA has varied within a range of about 3°C during the past 3,000 years.â€
A real scientific summary would look at average temperatures from around the globe not just this one for Sargasso Sea
3 – Real science uses a range of peer work. Such as these studies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:1000_Year_Temperature_Comparison.png
– These guys choose one study in a particular area and mis-use it, provide no other studies, and more importantly do not do any reasearch of their own.
You can choose to believe in facts are choose facts to support what you believe.
Less than an hour after I received an email about this video, I went to this website and I can’t see anything! Just a blank page where the video should be. Does this require a plugin I don’t have? But I would’ve thought that explorer would complain in that case.
Try using this link instead http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yrd3HYU80Dk&
I have the same problem with IE, on hundreds of pages. Use Firefox instead. Never a problem seeing the pages.
And with Firefox you never get “Internet Explorer has encountered a problem and needs to close.” That used to drive me batty.
the silliness of this video is awe inspiring. there has not been and is not now a test linking carbon dioxide to global warming. now at a time of declining global temperatures, carbon dioxide levels in the atmosphere are still increasing. the fact that there is a consensus of foolish, in some cases greedy, people means nothing. the fact that these people dub themselves “climatologists” means nothing. they have abandoned the scientific method and have as a result created this foolishness that they now wish to call “science”. have you no shame? william farrell
So just continue polluting the environment? Everything will be just fine? Pollution isn’t real, right? I am not a scientist, but I figured this out in eighth grade for my science fair project. I put some carbon dioxide in a box and put an ozone lamp over it. The air heated up faster and to a higher temperature than it did when I tried the same test with regular air. Seems to me that an eighth grade science project should give folks with ordinary intelligence the reasonable cause to believe that putting limitless amounts of Carbon Dioxide in the air is dangerous. Besides that, Carbon Dioxide is poisonous to humans. Do we need a eighth grade science fair project to prove that also?
The world is not a 1 square foot enclosed box you cannot ignore the dynamics involved in earths weather system. Why do you think they can’t get any, ANY, computer models to work with any credibility? Maybe they forgot to teach you in 5th grade plants need CO2
http://www.heartland.org/environmentandclimate-news.org/article/27390/Rising_CO2_Levels_Improving_Tree_Growth_.html
Maybe someone forgot to tell the volcano in Iceland that it was in violation of polluting our world. To put it in perspective the amount of CO2 caused by man is equivalent to the linoleum of the bottom floor of a ten story building. The rest of the building would be CO2 caused by nature.
No one is saying we can pollute the environment. We are saying that CO2, as a pollutant, is not the danger they are fudging all the data to make it out to be.
Joe,
First, the Heartland institute is anything but an independent organization. They have many reasons to disprove global warming. With that said, you need to read the real peer-reviewed research. You might want to start by reading the NASA website (the smartest people I know work for NASA and they don’t have a political agenda): http://www.nasa.gov/worldbook/global_warming_worldbook.html
You are right, the world isn’t 1 sq ft, but we can extrapolate from that type of experimentation. That is how science works. We build models on a smaller scale and scale them. Science is an extraordinary thing. It allows us to gather real data and draw conclusions about our physical world. This is different than say religion. IN religion, people know the truth going in and manipulate the findings to agree with the preconceived “truth.”
Rambo,
I work for NASA (JPL) and though there are a lot of smart people there, they are human after all. They do, in fact, have their agendas, political views, biases, etc. And a lot of them are smart enough to question the science too. You are right that science is an extraordinary thing, but it is not perfect. People always think a scientific conclusion is irrefutable, undeniable FACT! ..that is until someone comes along and proves it wrong. Man will forevermore try to explain this universe we live in, and will be reminded over and over how little we know.
Samuel,
If you read the rest of my posts, you will see that I absolutely understand what science is and why it is so powerful. Science is based on statistics and empirical data. The key foundation to science is that any theory can be disproved. It is much easier to disprove something than to prove something. We speak in terms of confidence intervals and we build on each others work. BTW, which department do you work in?
Let me restate my point: I am not a scientist. I am not qualified to have a scientific, conclusive opinion on this topic. (Maybe no scientist even, is qualified.) But just using plain simple logic here: I look around. I see the number of people on this planet. I see what we are doing and the level of CO2 emissions and other pollutants. I see the oceans filling with plastic. I see the pollution, etc, etc. So: populations are rising, pollution is rising, animals are struggling to survive, asthma rates are up in polluted neighborhoods. The only logical conclusion is that if we continue down this path, we will do some very serious damage. If it’s not the warming of the earth, it will be something else. If we don’t do anything to stem the tide, then I think we are just refusing to face reality and just hope that it will be okay. I haven’t read your link yet, but will do it now. To be honest, I have often hoped that the increasing level of CO2 would just cause trees to use more CO2, but that’s just me hoping. Can I be sure that it’s happening or happening at a sufficient rate? And what about the fact (I assume this is a fact?) that there are far fewer trees these days. I don’t know. Do I think we should really take that risk? I don’t. And to be frank, I think the people who refuse to take action to help prevent the further pollution of our planet are hiding their heads in the sand.
You have to be on drugs! You’re saying that people who don’t agree with the myth you call global warming are therefore somehow big on pollution? That’s as lame as suggesting that we could wipe out crime in the world if there were no guns. How about this one… “Imagine there’s no Heaven”. Where the hell do clowns like you come from?
Eric,
I don’t think you understood the post. He stated that he performed an experiment that demonstrated GW’ing on a small scale. This is science.
Your guns and your heaven comments are political and religious and really have no place in science or this debate.
CO2 is only one variable among thousands (if not millions – no one knows) in the equation of the temperature of our atmosphere. How often does the weatherman get the weather correct just three days out, or even the very next day? And we are supposed to believe anyone is capable of correctly predicting our weather at any point in our future? The arrogance of man is the extraordinary thing is all this.
Brian, you need to check your facts. You make yourself look silly…
Eddie,
Based on his post, Brian sounds young. Yet, the concept in the post is legitimate and holds more weight that most of the right wing propaganda in the other posts contained here.
No one would argue the fact that carbon dioxide is a necessary component of the atmosphere any more than one would argue the fact that Vitamin D is necessary in the human diet. However, excess Vitamin D in the diet can be extremely toxic. Living systems, be they an ecosystem or an organism, require that a delicate balance be maintained between certain elements and/or compounds in order for the system to function normally. When one substance is present in excess and as a result threatens the well being of an ecosystem, it becomes toxic, and could be considered to be a pollutant, despite the fact that it is required in small quantities.
Therefore, Brian isn’t wrong.
Ha! thanks Rambo! I’m 39, and I do have a graduate degree from Johns Hopkins, but it’s not in environmental science. Many thanks for the other entertaining comments as well about my age or grade level, but indeed, I’m trying to sound young, because the whole conversation doesn’t need to be complex unless you want it to be and I want to make sure everyone can understand my point, which is quite simple: We, humans are polluting the earth. Pollution is harmful. We should pollute less. Science, or no science, it seems like an obvious conclusion and I would like those who think we should just continue polluting to respond to this simple question: Should we continue polluting the earth as much as we want with no worry?
and Sean Bass, I see your comment below saying that no on is saying pollution isn’t real. Then why does it seem that most of people opposed to cap and trade are fixated on trying to claim that global warming is not real? They should instead be fixated on their real solution to the problem.
Brian,
I apologize. It is hard to tell sometimes. By young, I didn’t mean 15, I meant 20s (college student).
No one is saying pollution isn’t real. To better understand you should take a look at a book called-The Greening- by Doug Abrahms. It will help explain to you why paying a tax to a new international bank for carbon use will not help the environment. I know your proud of your eighth grade education but taxes do not help carbon emissions (carbon is not a poison, it is one of the basic elements that makes life possible on earth). There are horrible environmental issues out there, but you should not be conned by a group of international banksters that want money and power- this has nothing to do with the environment at all !!! Join the fight-even if some people like to use this info to discredit environmentalist, don’t let those ignorant people get in the way of your discovery that the green movement has been misdirected and highjacked by corporate lackeys.
Cap and trade will not likely work. However, a true tax on CO2 would. Businesses are influenced by costs. I know that because I have seen many of my co-workers canned for cheaper China replacements. I’m still around because I will work 24 hours a day and I will always out produce anyone. I do not lose. However, if the world taxed CO2, and alternative energy sources were cheaper, they would prevail.
I’m not talking green movement. I’m talking nuclear power, hydro, and whatever else is cheaper.
Do you have a link that talks about how this ties into banksters wanting money and power, or how dealing with global warming is a hoax that will financially benefit those who are perpetuating the hoax.
…”Dealing with global warming is a hoax that will financially benefit those who are peretuating the hoax…” The global warming issue, hoax or not (I believe it is a hoax or at the least an extreme exaggeration that we humans are pitifully powerless to affect) has benefited many, many people financially as well as politically. There are other motivations that I won’t go into. Just look at Al Gore’s net worth and tell me that the money he now has was because he invented the internet.
There is some clear thinking on this issue and a lot of bad thinking motivated by hatred, greed, jealousy, arrogance, and fear. Fear is ultimately what is being sold and people are buying it.
two different issues Brian. 1) Pollutions is unhealthy and should be reduced (ok, I can get behind that) but 2) CO2 is not pollution. CO2 is necessary for plant life and the more CO2 in the air, the more plants grow. In fact, if you grow produce and burn your own ethanol, you create a net loss of CO2 in the air as the growing process traps CO2 into the ground.
What’s amazing about our earth is that the so called polutant carbon is actually a nutrient for plants. I learned in the fourth grade that humans give of carbon, plants in turn use the carbon and release oxygen. The last time I checked was what mamals ie humans needed to sustain life. Its this minor scientific fact that most so called experts forget to include in their calculations. Its symbiotic relationship that keeps carbon from increasing in dramatic fashion. Go back and read a 3rd or 4th grade text book idiot.
How many conservative lemmings are going to repeat this?
No one would argue the fact that carbon dioxide is a necessary component of the atmosphere any more than one would argue the fact that Vitamin D is necessary in the human diet. However, excess Vitamin D in the diet can be extremely toxic. Living systems, be they an ecosystem or an organism, require that a delicate balance be maintained between certain elements and/or compounds in order for the system to function normally. When one substance is present in excess and as a result threatens the well being of an ecosystem, it becomes toxic, and could be considered to be a pollutant, despite the fact that it is required in small quantities.
So you say CO2 is the problem? Help us all out and stop personally prodiucing it.
You are mature.
You ought to get out of this argument now., Brian. It’s clear you don’t know the first thing about pollution and the climate.
Sam T,
Please bless us with your vast knowledge. Anyone can talk to the talk. Please, state your position backed with peer reviewed science. At least Brian is doing experiments and trying to learn about his world around him. I wish more American’s would do that instead of repeating talking points created by organizations with an agenda. Science is based on observation. Religion and politics is based on BS and preconceived notions.
Rambo, Religion is all about truth, and it’s even the capital-T Truth, not the lower-case truth that science aspires to. Also, after the bipartisan, fact-oriented, open-minded, honest discourse of the health care debate, how can you disparage politics?
I’m repeating myself, (see my reply to bone-a-potamus), but here you go Rambo. Below is the link to a report sent to Pres BO along with a petition signed 31,478 Scientists who believe Al Gore’s claims about global warming are based on bad science. http://www.oism.org/pproject/GWReview_OISM600.pdf
A Co2 tax would be a bureaucrats dream but a bureaucratic nightmare for the rest of us. We need more nanniest legislation such as you suggest like we need a hole in the head! And who do you think will eventually be forced to pay your “true tax on CO2†for businesses? It will be passed on to the already overly taxed consumer thanks in large part to an already overly intrusive government. Our government needs to stay the hell out of the free market and I suggest that absolutely no action be taken until the CO2 science question is resolved.
Lowrider -
First off, a petition proves nothing. We don’t know why people signed it or whether they are real people (see below.)
Second, the peer reviewed literature currently supports the theory of global warming. Those of us who understand science realize the importance of this fact.
Third, free markets are good, but require regulation. Examples: Child Labor in the late 1800s/early 1900s, environment pollution, tobacco. I do agree that markets should be more free than regulated, but regulation is a necessary part of society.
In response to your petition link:
A number of critics of the petition questioned the scientific credentials and the authenticity of the names of the signatories.
In May 1998 the Seattle Times wrote:
“ Several environmental groups questioned some of the names in the petition. For instance: “Perry S. Mason”, who was a legitimate scientist who shared the name of a TV character. Similarly, “Michael J. Fox”, “Robert C. Byrd”, and “John C. Grisham” were signatories with names shared with famous people. Geraldine Halliwell was added as: “Dr. Geri Halliwell” and “Dr. Halliwell.” This name may have been contributed by a proxy trying to discredit the petition since Ms. Halliwell has never admitted to signing the petition.
Asked about the pop singer, Robinson said he was duped. The returned petition, one of thousands of mailings he sent out, identified her as having a degree in microbiology and living in Boston. “When we’re getting thousands of signatures there’s no way of filtering out a fake”, he said.
â€
In 2001, Scientific American reported:
“ Scientific American took a random sample of 30 of the 1,400 signatories claiming to hold a Ph.D. in a climate-related science. Of the 26 we were able to identify in various databases, 11 said they still agreed with the petition —- one was an active climate researcher, two others had relevant expertise, and eight signed based on an informal evaluation. Six said they would not sign the petition today, three did not remember any such petition, one had died, and five did not answer repeated messages. Crudely extrapolating, the petition supporters include a core of about 200 climate researchers – a respectable number, though rather a small fraction of the climatological community. â€
In a 2005 op-ed in the Hawaii Reporter, Todd Shelly wrote:
“ In less than 10 minutes of casual scanning, I found duplicate names (Did two Joe R. Eaglemans and two David Tompkins sign the petition, or were some individuals counted twice?), single names without even an initial (Biolchini), corporate names (Graybeal & Sayre, Inc. How does a business sign a petition?), and an apparently phony single name (Redwine, Ph.D.). These examples underscore a major weakness of the list: there is no way to check the authenticity of the names. Names are given, but no identifying information (e.g., institutional affiliation) is provided. Why the lack of transparency?
Chip,
Religion can not be proven or disproved and does not belong in this debate. For example, who is right, Jesus or Allah? Politics is based on ideology and really not worth my time.
Brian,
Eddie just gave you some good advice – plant life ceases at low CO2 concentrations and we exhale it with every breath we (and every other mammal) take. Do yourself a favour and check this paper out….water vapour has 18 times more impact than CO2 – now we have stop evaporation and the rain – right???
http://www.warwickhughes.com/icecore/zjmar07.pdf
There is tremendous ignorance and fear mongering on both sides of this scientific issue. First off, lets be clear, the article you are referring was published in a non-refereed journal. That holds very little weight in the scientific community, but makes great propaganda.
Second, having more CO2 is not necessarily a bad thing and may or may not be causing the changes to weather patterns, we don’t know. As for those here who are using simplistic math logic, please, you are better off not posting. Yes, plants need CO2, nobody has EVER debated that (except ignorant people on the left, who are just as ignorant as those on the right without a science background).
The key point is the amount of increase of CO2 in the atmosphere since the industrial revolution. It is a very small amount . However, like CO2 is needed in the world, iron is needed by our bodies. A slight overdose of iron in your blood has a pretty bad negative impact and could eventually lead to death. That is why scientists are concerned. The reason it is a crisis now is because it will take decades in order to get countries around the world to reduce CO2 output, this isn’t something that can change in months or even a few years.
As for people manipulating models, that is what scientists do. Do you really think that every scientist simply applies some magical formula and out shoots a clear answer? Climate data is more complex than most. There are many variables and getting the regression analyis correct is very difficult. The fact that scientists are working with different data sets and formulas is business as usual.
Here is how statistics works… You create a null and alternative hypothesis. The goal is to reject the null which esentially “proves” the alternative within some range on confidence (90%, 95%, 99%, etc). Nothing in statistics is absolute.
The bottom line is that scientists got caught up in a political mess. I’ve reviewed all the “evidence” and I don’t see a cover-up. I see scientists hard at work. The right is wrong for attacking Climatologists. The right doesn’t want to pay more in taxes (regardless of whether it is a pragmatic or an ideological concern)
On the other hand, the left should be honest about the data as well and express that there is an unknown factor as with any science. Albeit a very small error, there is a chance for an error. Of course, because of our ignorant population, very small error means it is not truth. Like evolution…
If your really worried about the US economy, I would focus on the education system. Everyday highly paid, good engineering jobs are moving to China. China teaches science and math and doesn’t focus their energy on making everything a political or religious issue.
Worst case, cap and trade passes. What is the real economic impact? What is the real CO2 impact? My studies have revealed both have been overblown.
Cheers.
Rambo,
I’m not sure how old you are, but if you knew anything about the past few decades you might find some surprises.
The same “scientists” that are now complaining about how our pollutants (CO2 among others) are causing our current “predicament” were exclaiming loudly about global cooling in the early 70′s. There were the same villains and the same saviors. We were the villains and higher taxes would save us. Didn’t happen.
If you’d really reviewed all the evidence as you claim you’d see that our planet has been steadily cooling for the past 10 years or so. Surprisingly the other planets in our solar system have been undergoing the same cooling. If you’d care to examine the 10 years or so before that you’d see that there was a modest increase in temperature on the earth…. and guess what! The other planets out to Neptune showed the same increase. Amazing how that happens. All without our taxes going up a bit.
I’m sure you found during your study of the facts that the CO2 level rose after the temperature rose and not the other way around. The level also falls when the temperature drops. Again, not the other way around. Interesting correlation!
I find it interesting that you tend to disparage people on the left only when you can cast more upon the people on the right. Do you have an agenda that you’re not expressing.
I also find it interesting that you reference Scientific American. I remember when they were a real science magazine. Do you? Now, it’s quite clear to any discerning minds that they have sold out to political ideology and have ceased being a true force for science. Sad really.
Plus, too much of anything is poisonous. Oxygen is the most corrosive and destructive element roaming free on the planet. Try breathing pure oxygen when you’re scuba diving. At a depth of 40 feet you’ll die a horrible death. Should we use your logic and tax oxygen use too. Let’s round up some “scientists” and I’m sure we could get a consensus that too much O on the planet is bad and should be regulated.
We’re talking parts per million on CO2, way less than even a tenth of a percent. The variations over the last 1000 years has been minuscule, yet the temperature variations have been at times extreme. I’m sure you’ve heard of the year without a summer. How about Greenland being named that by the Vikings because it was green when it was discovered. Either that or they have a warped sense of humor.
Try expounding with facts and not your own personal agenda. Me, I have one too. To not have people raise my taxes using bogus science and scare tactics. What a novel idea. For you to say that cap and trade would not have an economic impact reveals your naivete.
David,
Thanks for the comment. I’m not “that” old, but I am aware of the skeptics argument that the “same” scientists blew it once before so they are obviously messing up again. In reality, that isn’t true.
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/01/the-global-cooling-myth/
Notice how the arguments are made. They have quotes and citations which I have verified.
CO2 is not poison, I never said it was. The impact of CO2 on the environment certainly could have a negative effect. Kind of like taking too much vitamin D. It isn’t a poison, but too much is harmful to the body.
You manipulation of the data is almost comical. I hear anti-GW advocates play both sides. I hear the climate has been cooling for a decade (that is manipulation of data) and I hear climate is way too complex to predict in the long term. Both are true, but have really nothing to do with the price of tea in China.
As for my agenda, it is a better future for my kids. I work, pay a lot of money in taxes, and support my family. I’m not for cap and trade. I for applying a direct tax on all fossil fuels. Tax the living daylights out of them. It will be painful at first, but once the costs of using fossil fuels exceed those of other sources, companies will invest in more research to optimize other fuel sources. However, as long as we continue to have relatively cheap fossil fuels, we will continue to fund terrorism and potentially negatively impact the environment.
You mention that CO2 is poisonous to humans. It is not. CO is poisonous to humans. All plant life needs CO2 to thrive. Plants take in CO2 and give back oxygen which we need. No CO2 = no plants = no life = dead planet.
I learned that in 3rd grade.
Again, I have to re-post this. LEMMINGS STOP ALREADY!
No one would argue the fact that carbon dioxide is a necessary component of the atmosphere any more than one would argue the fact that Vitamin D is necessary in the human diet. However, excess Vitamin D in the diet can be extremely toxic (6). Living systems, be they an ecosystem or an organism, require that a delicate balance be maintained between certain elements and/or compounds in order for the system to function normally. When one substance is present in excess and as a result threatens the well being of an ecosystem, it becomes toxic, and could be considered to be a pollutant, despite the fact that it is required in small quantities.
Brian, You need to look up the difference between Carbon Dioxide and Carbon Monoxide.
Carbon dioxide is used by plants during photosynthesis to make sugars, which may either be consumed in respiration or used as the raw material to produce other organic compounds needed for plant growth and development.
Carbon monoxide (CO), also called carbonic oxide, is a colorless, odorless and tasteless gas, which is highly toxic to humans and animals
Harrie,
He was talking about CO2. You need to look up the difference.
So, since the biggest source of carbon dioxide is the animal kingdon, of which we as humans are a member, id it justifiable then to say that we should all just stop breathing and that will fix the problem??? Just wondering.
Another intelligent post.
And did they let you out of the 8th grade yet ?
Do they let you out yet? Come on, lets grow up and have an honest discussion.
Brian,
Since I don’t know what grade you are in now, I’ll refrain from blasting your post too hard. Perhaps you’re in 9th grade now. That would at least explain your lack of scientific understanding and your flawed experiments. I’ll tackle just a few basics here in the hopes that you will be open-minded enough to at least consider the possibility that you are wrong in this case.
1) Carbon dioxide is not poisonous in the amounts found in the atmosphere, not even close! Most outdoor areas contain around 350 ppm (http://www.wapa.gov/es/pubs/techbrf/co2.htm), or 0.035% CO2, far below the safe exposure limits. It is not in the scope of a short response to cover all the tests that have been conducted on exposure limits of CO2, but if you’re really interested in the subject, just to a search for “carbon dioxide toxicity” and read the information on the scientific websites. Stay away from the political fanatics on both sides. One easy to read place to start is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_dioxide#Toxicity
2) By “ozone lamp” I assume you are referring to a shortwave UV bulb (UVC) like the ones commonly used in laboratory sterilization boxes. As Joe correctly points out, a 1-foot, enclosed square box is hardly a good representation of our atmosphere. The simple reality is that all radiation that reaches our planet, be it from the sun or other sources, is filtered through miles of atmosphere, including the ozone layer. Along the way, some of the radiation (most of the harmful radiation) is absorbed and converted into other forms of energy, mostly heat. What’s left when it hits the ground is either absorbed or reflected back out again. That which is absorbed will, ultimately, be re-radiated back out to space in one form or another. Again, there is not enough room here for an in-depth lesson on radiophysics, but at least entertain the concept that a few more ppm of CO2 probably won’t change how the planet absorbs and re-radiates heat from and to outer space. It’s kind of like trying to sprinkle a teaspoon of flour over yourself as a blanket for sleeping.
3) Lastly, please don’t lump those people who don’t believe the man-made global warming lie in with those who are actually polluting the environment. You want to shout at polluters? Yell at countries like China and Mexico who dump toxic waste into the rivers and oceans like it’s their own personal toilet bowl. Why do you think all the Ni-Cad manufacturers are fleeing to those countries? It’s because they know that these, and many third-world countries (Yes, I know China is not 3rd World) simply don’t care. If you want to do something close to home, yell at people who still dump used motor oil into the ground (Yes, it has heavy metals and other toxins from your engine and combustion in it) when they can drop it off for free at any auto parts store for recycling. I could go on and on, but I’ll get off my soap box for now. They are the polluters, not people who don’t believe in Al Gore’s mythical version of science.
Final question: How much do you think we should fine Iceland for the massive amounts of CO2 that their volcano is spewing into our atmosphere?
-Peter
You have oversimplified climate change, but you get the main point. The sad thing is that your point is more valid that the majority of posts I’ve read on this forum. Keep up the scientific research!
Carbon MONOxide is poisonous to humans. Co2 is NOT, except in extremely HIGH concentrations comparable to breathing air. Nor is it poisonous to plants. It is what they live on, which was also an 8th (or 7th) grade science lesson…a little process known as “photosynthesis”. They also seem to quite THRIVE on it. Check out this vid called “Seeing is Believing” if you don’t believe me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qVNK6zFgE&feature=player_embedded
I’ve yet to hear of “suicide by Dt. Coke and pop rocks”……both of which utilize CARBON DIOXIDE in their manufacturing…but, what a way to go, eh?
Excellent! Made me chuckle!
NO CAP AND TRADE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This cap and ..tax.. was designed to make a few rich and enslave everyone else.
Thats why a communist wack job was appointed to the EPA.To claim the air we exhale is a poison gas is a crock!
Just imagine what that could mean to old or sick people 20 years down the road.
They might see ad on tv saying EVERYONE 60 YEARS OLD OR SICK ,PLEASE REPORT TO THE SLEEP CENTER.After all they’re just trying to save the planet don’t you know
I agree with you that all of Global warming is a farce. I remember when Al Gore made the movie, an “Inconvenient truth”, they used pieces of polystyrene to mimic icebergs breaking up in the ocean. Also, the locacions of the sensoring stations on asphalt, next to restaurant exhaust fans, etc. This is just another way of extracting money from us and add to our already heavy taxburden. Thank you for doing this video, I hope a lot more people will wake up to this scam..
Al Gore is a farce, yes. Global warming is the best science that we have today. There is a significant amount of data showing the increase of CO2 in the atmosphere. Real scientists, not Al Bore, have been warning about the potential for GW’ing since the 1970s. Today, we have a lot more data to back up those hypothesis.
BTW, I’m against cap and trade. It won’t do squat. I prefer a direct tax on CO2 emissions. And use those funds only for energy investment (nuclear, and emerging).
Even if you don’t understand the science behind GW’ing, you have to admit that those dirty coal plants (which I grew up next to) aren’t a good thing. I remember how clean our white house was with the clean coal plant about five miles away.
This video was well done and much better than many of the crappy rappy junk being put out perhaps a new career is in order for the creators of this work of art, Perhaps a broadway smash hit is in the making
This is what happens when the society becomes complacent letting the political system to expand by taking control over larger and larger part of our life without proper checks and balances. We have let them use the tool of crisis to justify implementation of gradually larger control of all areas of our society.
A complacent society is the perfect growing ground for a socialistic system to expand undetected to the point that we are seeing today in USA. It has been allowed to build a web of dependencies among some groups of citizens, educational systems, and scientist communities while transferring wealth to the closest supporters.
The USA is the last outpost of a free society and it is for us to loose!
What are you talking about? Your dreamed up alternate reality? Please, provide sources to your insane thoughts. What socialism? Transfer of wealth? Come on..
Glad the video is back and never stop talking.
THANKS FOR THE REST OF THE STORY!!
NO CAP & TRADE!!
this was good. Keep up the great work.
FYI, Carbon Dioxide is not poisonous. Carbon Monoxide is. So the eighth grade scientist is a bit off. The answer to the carbon dioxide problem is to plant more trees.
No one would argue the fact that carbon dioxide is a necessary component of the atmosphere any more than one would argue the fact that Vitamin D is necessary in the human diet. However, excess Vitamin D in the diet can be extremely toxic. Living systems, be they an ecosystem or an organism, require that a delicate balance be maintained between certain elements and/or compounds in order for the system to function normally. When one substance is present in excess and as a result threatens the well being of an ecosystem, it becomes toxic, and could be considered to be a pollutant, despite the fact that it is required in small quantities.
Lemmings….
I’m laughing again. I got worried for a minute that maybe my ignorant self should stop making comments! Because while I do generally know the difference between CO and CO2 it is quite possible that I did not state the facts when I said that CO2 is poisonous. You had me worried so I did a little search (remember, I’m not a scientist, I’m just using logic like most Americans must do on this topic) and found this web page:
http://www.inspectapedia.com/hazmat/CO2gashaz.htm
that discusses the “Fatal Levels of Carbon Dioxide in a Building”
But would it matter if CO2 itself were not “poisonouss?” My point still stands strong: We are polluting our earth. Pollution is harmful. We should reduce our impact. It is not rocket science and doesn’t need to be.
Carbon dioxide is poison, doan’cha no. It is killing all the plants!
I hope this is your version of humor. All of us who paid attention in school know that plants need CO2 for photosynthesis to work. Remember? That’s the process of creating the nutrients they need while releasing oxygen, which animals need to breathe. Without CO2, no plants. Without plants, no oxygen. Without oxygen, no people.
No one would argue the fact that carbon dioxide is a necessary component of the atmosphere any more than one would argue the fact that Vitamin D is necessary in the human diet. However, excess Vitamin D in the diet can be extremely toxic. Living systems, be they an ecosystem or an organism, require that a delicate balance be maintained between certain elements and/or compounds in order for the system to function normally. When one substance is present in excess and as a result threatens the well being of an ecosystem, it becomes toxic, and could be considered to be a pollutant, despite the fact that it is required in small quantities.
I think, like so many other things in the political arena, the average citizen has been far less then well informed about the science, hard facts AND the hidden influence/agendas that motivate policy like Cap and Trade. Its high time we all wake the hell up out here and find out what is REAL and what is a smoke screen for hidden agendas in the political arena. We have been depending on representatives to understand and research this all for us while we go about our daily lives, half heartedly listening to highly managed blurbs of info in the media. I don’t think that every person in politics is corrupt, but there is too much of it in all parties and we can no longer depend on them to make decisions in our best interest. Taking a stand on the side of ‘right’ in this situation seems easy enough if the information is presented in a way to make the uniformed person believe that they are ‘doing what is right for the world’. WE ALL WANT THAT! But taking that stand on poor/manipulated science is not doing what is right for the world at all, and in fact will inevitably result in something negative. Yes, pollution is a problem. Period. I don’t believe anyone is foolish enought to arguing agaist that. And we all need to do our part to reduce it. But how devastating could this be to our country, our kids, and the rock we call home if our hearts are in the right place in pushing for this, yet the information be based our actions on is wrong? More information is still needed.
Well, that information is all available in peer reviewed journals. In a democracy, you have the right and responsibility to learn and to read. You have the right to an education. You are the person that is responsible. If you think the scientific community who has been studying this issue since the 1970s is wrong, great. You should posit an alternative theory and have it peer reviewed. See, that is how science works. There is no free lunch. Scientists have to do the work and make their case. It must be supported with math and logic. Pure science is unrelated to politics.
It isn’t like the government is hiding data. You can download the data at data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/ and perform your own statistical analysis. If you can come up with a better model and explanation than current climatologists, you will likely have a promising future in science. Scientists wish global warming wasn’t real or man made. However, that isn’t what the data says.
The U.S.A. is almost a socialist country. This Cap and Trade will put us one step closer. What happened to freedom? Do we need another revolution? If so where do I sign up!
…talk about fear mongering. Is that all the right can do during modern debates, yell socialism? Cap and trade likely won’t have a significant impact on CO2. It also won’t have a significant impact on what you call “freedom.” Where did you attend school? What level education do you have?
You can sign up for the revolution in Somalia. No government, no taxes, no regulation. It is a great place to live.
You have made sence. It is important that we start to recheach what they are telling us. One Fact that is not being put out there is Who are Al Gores main Partners in his Green business ventures…. Could the be exec. from Goldman/Sacks….. Who will be one of the main Traders of Carbon Credits….. Who suppies(CASH) for the green movements many LIES….. Look up Goldman Sacks…… This is their next run on the US tax payer…… Yes keep up on the science of LIES…… Remember to keep the usa down you have to create Lies take the cash…..Create more Lies……. Take the cash…….
Why is oil going up???? If you cantrol the spot market….. You control the price……. There is an oil shortage…… Oil is a Carbon Poluter…… You Guys are smarter than me….. Follow the Lie and Follow the cash…… Keep up the good work….. It is not JUST TAXES>>>> He who makes the cash buys the Senators/Congressmen— And get to make the rules…… Then the get to do it all over again…..
Sorry for the poor quality of my typing….. Hope you get the message…… Government sponsored Lies…… Keep Digging…… Hopefully you get it before it is to late……
Vote in 2010……. But do your home work…… Keep asking questions.
Ok Jim, tell me, what is “your” truth?
Follow the money. Al Gore has already made tens of millions trading CO2 credits. The “Global Warming Industry” of university scientists depend on government grants that will disappear when the truth comes out : man-made emissions of CO2 have a negligible impact on temperature compared with natural emissions, and the major driver – solar activity. No more $$ if there is no looming catastrophe.
If you really want to know what drives climate change, google “Bob Carter balanced discussion of climate change”.
Gore is one of the biggest demagogue-charlatans ever to walk the planet. Or should we say, slither?
Correct. Al Gore and others have profited off of Climate change and they live high on the hog. They contribute more CO2 than small communities. But, lets get beyond that. Simply because Al Gore is an idiot has no correlation to the science behind global warming which is decades in the making.
If you really want to know what drives climate change, go to a university and get a degree. If you don’t understand the basics, all the talking points and “funded science” you read is basically junk science put out there by like minded people to make you feel good.
The bottom line is that everyone should be a skeptic. The evidence should be reviewed. When doing your own research, make sure you give peer reviewed journals a higher weight than literature that anybody can publish. Also, note where the funding for the research came from. Another point to weigh is political affiliation. If the author always writes pro-liberal papers, the value should be lessened. If the author always writes pro-conservative papers, the value should be lessened. The best papers are those funded from the government written by researchers with no political affiliation. If you read those papers, they are overwhelmingly in support of the theory of global warming due to man made CO2.
Just something to think about.
I just love it when the global warming people get cought whit their pant down and they try to scare good people with the truth is exposed.
What truth was “exposed?”
Excellent!
BTW… Who gets credit for performing artist?
Maybe not the best graphics work, but you are to be commended for doing something. It’s amazing that people are quick to judge while sitting on their butts doing nothing. If they were busy trying to rescue the world from the corporate criminals they wouldn’t have time to judge..
Keep up the good work!
Perfect. No cap and trade. Love the chicken~
Absolutely great. Really gets under Mann’s and other Leftist climate “scientists’” skin. The seemingly amateurish production of this video adds to its credibility. It’s solid gold and the Left-wing Losers who whine about it just dig themselves deeper into the hole from which they’ll never crawl out.
Americans are being pounded across the head with the obvious…yet so many still can’t see how ridiculously fraudulant Cap and Trade is. Al Gore loves his planet so much, huh? Yeah, that’s why he profits from biofuel gmo crops that are destroying our natural ecosystem while simultaneously using up all our valuable food-producing farmland and creating a large cesspool of genetic and chemical pollutants. Where’s all the research money coming from to support cap and trade initiatives? Oh, yeah…from all the largest polluting corporations! I could go on and on with every organization and office involved…My veins just boil thinking about the arrogance and greed of these criminals… Do away with all the regulatory agencies because here IN AMERICA, INFORMED CONSUMERS ARE THE BEST REGULATORS!!! When we see companies acting irresponsible with our environment or human rights WE STOP BUYING FROM THEM.
What will it take for the masses to realize that every natural resource needed for life is being hijacked by politics? “Food Safety” bills prohibiting natural and independent access to food. “Conservation” bills that limit our rights to hunt or fish or water our gardens. Energy and fuel market manipulations, taxes and restrictions. Our right to exhale CO2 and for plants to breathe it in. Our human right to procreate and to raise our children by our own instincts and philosophies also threatened by govt mandates. Losing rights to our own personal health and medicine beliefs. We are poisoned daily by “regulated” chemicals in our foods, water supply, and fraudulant pharmaceuticals…and they have the balls to punish us for THEIR NEGLIGENT and ABUSIVE ACTIONS???
For what these govt and corporate criminals have spent in furthering their own personal agendas of power and control…they could have implemented sound ecologically beneficial restorations of soil, water, and air across the globe…eliminating poverty and disease along the way. And BY THAT FACT ALONE is proof that these people are frauds. I patiently await the tarring and feathering of all these crooks. *Wooo! I feel better now…thanks for letting me vent*
I hope you feel better. Yes, Al Gore is a flipping idiot. He is one of the biggest hypocrites out there. Good thing he didn’t become president. Although, I wish we would have had McCain back in 2000. I’m not a fan of Bush either… Anyway.
Please cite the research that shows consumers are the best regulators? From a talking point perspective, it makes sense. However, pragmatically, it is false. Perhaps a truly informed consumer is the best regulator? That would mean that we have an educated population and properly labeling on all products and services.
For example, take drug companies. Consumers have no clue what is good and what isn’t, all they know is what they see on television. Drug companies easily manipulate the American population into thinking that they need their products and many of them are simple “me-to” drugs. In some cases, the over the counter substitutes work just as good for a fraction of the cost. The American consumers are fat, lazy, and ignorant. Sorry, but the truth hurts.
Another example, supplements. I go to buy creatine for body building, but it isn’t regulated. I have no idea what is really in that bottle I bought. Nobody really knows. In hope of quality, customers buy the expensive stuff that was reviewed by some magazine and hope for the best. Most consumers don’t know that supplements are not regulated…
I’m not really sure where your tangents were going… But conservation laws are in place to conserve. If everyone could hunt or fish at anytime, there wouldn’t be anything left. And about your rights to “personal health and medicine beliefs” is bordering on insane! Since when is medicine a belief? What, are you a witch doctor? Medicine is based on science and statistics. Many levels of trials are conducted. And it works. Look at the life expectancy.
Last, you need to take a math class. “For what these govt and corporate criminals have spent in furthering their own personal agendas of power and control…they could have implemented sound ecologically beneficial restorations of soil, water, and air across the globe…eliminating poverty and disease along the way. And BY THAT FACT ALONE is proof that these people are frauds. I patiently await the tarring and feathering of all these crooks.”
You are off on the costs exponentially. I’m not really sure which way you lean (right or left) but whatever it is, it is extreme and borderline insanity. You may want to consider taking some courses at your local community college on logic and reasoning, math, and basic science. Sorry to be rude, but the truth hurts.
@Rambo…Insanity? Being stuck in the left or right political wheel is what’s insane. That’s one of the reasons why we are in this mess in the first place…divided on issues designed for paradox. The problem is that we are being taken advantage of. Media spews contradictory information continuously. Its no wonder people are so confused…My comment on “consumers being the best regulators” is not a crazy idea…in fact, most cases of environmental abuse that have come to light have been the result of consumer whistleblowing. My point was that, when given TRUTHFUL information, consumers are the best regulators. But in regards to the Cap and Trade issue, exactly how will massive taxes improve our environment? Do you really trust govt and industry to find efficient remedies when they are receiving steady cash flow from the “crisis”? Regulating CO2 has some pretty grim consequences if abused.
You call me extreme on medicine? LOL! Modern medical advancements save lives…but pharmaceutical monopoly and influence over medicine is a huge problem. We agree on that…so why am I a witch doctor? I just eat smart, exercise, and research drugs and supplements instead of blindly putting things in my body which I do not understand. The FDA doesn’t seem to require much independent research before approving drugs…yet they attack natural supplements that have been proven effective by scientific methods over and over again…so it’s up to consumers again to make the best choices for themselves by their own research of products and companies. Medicine is not all based on science…one example would be vaccinations, which has been based on theory for over 300 years yet hasn’t been officially proven safe or effective scientifically. Notice the continuous contraversy throughout history on vacs? http://www.whale.to/a/mcbean3.html …this is an oldie but full of actual case studies that haven’t changed all that much over the decades since.
Conservation is an important element in personal responsibility…but humans still need to eat, keep warm or cool, and use water. These are natural rights that shouldn’t be infringed by extreme taxation or otherwise. I’m not so naive that I don’t see how increasingly restrictive regulations are in controlling our basic life necessities. Nothing good has ever come from govt control over necessary resources, a major factor in why we still have plenty of disease, poverty and hunger left in the world.
Your generalization of Americans as being fat, lazy and ignorant is uncalled for. Yes, there are plenty that fit into these catagories…but lack of truthful information is usually the root cause. Fortunately, more Americans are now paying attention and becoming more self reliant…and using common sense instead of relying on media hype. You can keep the “talking points” and the “left-right paradigm”…Our country’s crisis is a corrupt govt that has been dirty for many administrations…on many issues… and is about ready to implode.
First, I don’t support cap and trade, I support a direct tax on all CO2 emissions. A direct tax will raise the cost of using CO2 producing fuels, like coat and gas, and provide incentive to solve the problem in other ways. I work for corporate America and I know exactly how increased costs in one area can fund significant research in another area. This will work.
I concur that everyone should eat smart and exercise. We disagree on drug companies and the government. Supplements are dangerous, period. Not because the supplement itself it necessarily dangerous or bad, but because we don’t know what is really in it. Without regulation, supplement companies can mislabel their products (http://www.sportsci.org/jour/0003/lmb.html). You can read and study supplements all you want, but unless you are going to test everyone you buy before you ingest it, you are playing Russian roulette.
As for vaccines, I feel sorry for you. You really should take a course in statistics, science, and medicine. You will always be able to find antecedent cases of damage caused by vaccine. My son has autism, so don’t go there. It had nothing to do with vaccines. Jenny McCarthy is an ignorant fool. However, vaccines have NEVER wiped out entire populations like the diseases that they protect against (Smallpox, etc.)
What do you consider “extreme” taxation? Do you realize that our current taxes are historically low? Did you know that if are married and make $50,000 or less and have two children, not only do you not pay taxes, but the federal government will give you a check?
I agree, some governments cause problems, especially governments not allowing their people access to bio-engineered crops or vaccines. You seem to contradict yourself here…
Yes, I generalize Americans as fat and lazy. This is not an opinion (http://www.ehd.org/health_obesity.php).
You seem to want to blame the government for everything. It is easy to blame something as faceless as “the government.” However, we need to blame ourselves. We elected “the government” and we live here…
Exactly Holly, it’s all about control. If you have the opportunity see FLOW [For the Love of Water], it sums up this in a microcosm. Industry wants to make money off of everyone. Part of the IMF and World Banks (along with the corporations, because as we all know, the private banking industry is the pinacle of the corporate system) policy of EPP [Every-Person-Pays]. What Cap and Trade will do, is deny the poorest of the poor heat, shelter, and sustenance by raising the price of all these things. All the right/left paradigm does is divide and conquer us. As long as we are divided arguing over the minutiae, the corporations are stealing our basic rights to liberty. We have forgotten, that the basic premise of our Declaration of Independence was to make us sovereigns; and to institute governments among us to serve as our servants, not our masters. Corporations have set themselves over us, we must take back from them, what we have allowed them to slowly steal away from us and the world through stealth and subterfuge. This isn’t about Cap and Trade and the altuism of the world’s elite ie Al Gore, Godlman Sachs, (let us not forget Ken Ley of Enron helped to formulate this whole scheme), and all the rest of the fake Greenies Bill Gates, Ted Turner (who owns more private land than anyone else on earth), etc., if you truly read into what they want is a worldwide eugenics program to eliminate what Henry Kissinger refers to as “useless eaters”…that meaning, you and I, along with the third world. Their aim is to be the elites in a scientific socialist dictatorship, limiting the slave population to (see Georgia Guidestones). You can’t make this stuff up.
Algore hould be arrested for fraud and criminal activity, selling a LIED to gullyble people.
Arrested for what? I’m not a fan of his, but if he should be arrested for his GW’ing movie, what should happen to GW Bush and his war in Iraq over nonexistent WMDs which are killing our soldiers? Did you know that on average, 18 US vets kill themselves EVERYDAY? Bush and his administration created the policies for this hell they live in (stop gap, etc).
The warming, if any, due to a small increase in CO² is minuscule. Climatologists are trying desperately to tease some sort of 1/10° signal out of data that is chaotic, with daily ranges in the tens of degrees C. To get this signal, which they just KNOW has to be there, they are willing to use “novel” statistical techniques, apply data “corrections” to torque the trends in the “right” direction, cherry pick, and generally misbehave. One primary tool is their new pseudoscience of dildoclimatology.
The amount of CO2 is tiny, yes. But so is the amount of cyanide you need to ingest to kill yourself instantly. Hence, the reason for the research. Simply because you don’t want something to be true doesn’t make it so. Humans are ignorant. We think that we can will stuff via propaganda. In reality, the physical world is much more powerful than that. We should continue to research the issue.
The environmental leftist frauds had to make CO2, the industrial gas, as the bad guy in their AGW movement to scam the industrial countries. Problem is they hung their hat on the wrong gas and had to cook the books to make it appear to be true. The socialist democrats were the enablers who funded this fraud from the beginning. They will pay a heavy political price come November for ripping the american taxpayers off to the tune of 70+ billion dollars on this scam.
If you are worried about ripping off tax payers, I think think your hatred is aimed in the wrong direction. http://costofwar.com/
Who cares about CO2? It is an opportunity to get off the dirty coal and get into nuclear energy. Coal is dirty, very dirty. I lived five miles from a clean coal plant growing up. Our white house was rarely white and our pool had a lot of black specs in it. If it takes regulating CO2 to get people to conserve and the country to move to cleaner fuels like nuclear, great. In any case, it is better than all the money we wasted on bombs and war that got us nothing…
The heat from the amount of CO2 that is added to Earth’s atmosphere by man is equal to adding one drop of warm water every three days to a 10,000L tank of cold water. (From “Air Con” by Ian Wishart.) If CO2 were such a real, imminent threat, then we would need to go after “Big Coke and Big Pepsi,” and ban carbonated drinks, because, in drinking them you are putting POISON into your body!! While we are at it legislating, we should close all public schools and mandate that all students attend classes online, and reduce their carbon footprint by cutting out all that commuting to school and back. “Big education” just isn’t sustainable!!
You obviously need to understand the science before I will even respond to your ignorant comment. Take a couple college courses, read a few books, and stop reading those darn talking points on the Internet.
If you want the facts about the so called global warming threat, read the book, “State of Fear”. It’s nearly 600 pages are well documented and backed up by authority. It is literally filled with precise charts and graphs illustrating that, if there was any increase in average world temperature over the past 100 years, it was insignificant (probably not more than 1 degree F.). The reason I state “probably” is because the developing countries had no accurate way of measuring and tracking temperatures, etc. Therefore, no one really knows what the average world temperatures were 100 years ago to allow an exact comparison with the current level. Based on the accurate information from developed countries and using the best scientific assumptions, the average world temperature may have risen about 1 degree F and, over the next 100 years, it may also increase another 1 degree F. regardless of man’s puny efforts.
One thing “State of Fear” states is that for 30 years in the 20th century, the average CO2 levels in the USA were steadily increasing, while during the same 3 decade period, the average temperature was gradually declining. To my engineering mind, this fact, documented in the most scientifically advanced country in the world, proves that rising carbon dioxide levels do NOT cause warming.
Two years ago, the coldest temperatures in decades occurred in the Antarctic. It was so cold that 40 ft. high waves, driven onto the shore by high winds, flash froze in place (the salt water temperature was already below freezing but it didn’t freeze until it was exposed to the extremely cold air). In that same year, new ice formed in the Arctic region as well. I have seen photos of these huge waves still standing days later. These facts are ignored or hidden from the UN and some of our esteemed “scientists”.
For thousands of years, the average temperatures have swung both up and down in a natural weather cycle. If a modern man lived as long as Methuselah, he could no doubt recall several of these swings in his lifetime that are for the most part independent of man’s activities.
CO2 is not toxic in the usual sense of the word. Excessive amounts of CO2 can create problems for animals only if the concentration gets so high that it crowds out too much oxygen. For instance, in cold climates, a person who sleeps with his/her head covered up by multiple blankets could pass out from respiratory distress if the CO2 level gets too high under the covers. (I wonder if this is one reason people have heart attacks in their sleep and, of course, it has been documented that most of these people never wake up). CO, on the other hand, is toxic and this lighter than air compound can be quite deadly.
People like to make themselves feel better, so they read and watch whatever reinforces their belief system. In reality, there is scientific data and theories on global warming.
In response to your book citation:
Several scientists whose research had been referenced in the novel stated that Crichton had distorted it in the novel. Peter Doran, leading author of the Nature paper, wrote in the New York Times stating that
“… our results have been misused as “evidence†against global warming by Michael Crichton in his novel “State of Fearâ€
This whole enviromental movement is flawed due to the fact that every product produced by man comes from the Earth and will turn to dust in the same manner it was removed .
I think anyone who believes mankind can control the weather is a kook. Unfortunately, the kooks took over the asylum years ago. All you can do about it really is to figure out how to make money along with the kooks. Im thinking ADM will make a killing by not turning the soil they own, thereby giving them more money in carbon credits than they can make feeding people, and GS will make tons more money on the carbon derivatives. I am buying stock in both of them and hoping the kooks inflate the balloon enough too let me retire. It just seems obvious that carbon credits are the easiest way to make a multi-billion industry out of thin air.
May the truth and truthful facts win. Boy, it sure is a good thing childhood asthma is on the decline. I was worried there for a bit…. This reminds me of why I try searching for my facts from various places. Places which work more on facts than opinions. yeah… the boring places that don’t sell. The reasonable places where polite, intelligent debate is encouraged and commonplace. And the people who have the last word are…. various, unpredictable, and not planned by the executives. Teamwork in the middle is what we all need. Trim the fat of right wing and left wing extremists.
Read peer reviewed scientific journals. All media is crap. Journalists are rarely qualified to review and summarize a peer reviewed paper, but they do it all the time. If you have a passion in climate science, buy text books, study them and get subscriptions to peer reviewed journals. That is the only way to understand the data. There are few “facts” on global warming. There are hypothesis and theories. Huffpo, Drudge, Fox News, MSNBC are not good places to get “facts” LOL!
The simpleness of the video speaks volumes. It tries to transform a complex scientific issue into a second grade name calling contest. This is politics at its worst. In the worst case, global warming is happening rapidly and will cause harm to the Earth in the short term. In the best case, global warming is caused by natural phenomena and there is nothing that humans can do about it. What is the point of attacking a scientist? It shows the ignorance of the political right and the stupidity of the American population.
Climate change is a scientific issue. We need more unbiased research and less political interference. This work has been going on for decades. Al Gore had nothing to do with it. He is an opportunist. Real scientists are after the “truth.”
We all want to feel “good.” That is why we create groups of people that are inferior to us. That is why we create religions. However, the real, empirical world is a cold and unforgiving place. We all need to remember that.
My kids liked the one with the rabbits crying while the tree gets chopped down a lot better. All of these pro peer reviewed posters here are forgetting 2 very basic things. All of the “climate-gate” scientists were peer reviewed and they were lying, lying, lying! It breaks down to one specific reason, their funding streams were pro-warming. What an amazing planet God gave us, we the humans and animal breathe oxygen and expel CO2, which the plants that cover the earth need, use, and they create ozygen for us to use again. I prefer God over some, worried about his funding so I’ll make these #’s work to secure further funding sources scientist, ESPECIALLY a lying scientist. The volume of our atmosphere is millions if not 100 billion fold over the small little creatures walking around on the surface.
And second of all, this whole thing is a means to control every single thing you do, or buy, or want or need. Control people, CONTROL, after all, it’s for the environment. That is the opposite of freedom, it’s more like Maxism. Silly little pro warmers, you think government has compassion and will protect you. For a bunch of peer reviewed scientists you sure are MORONS. In this argument I prefer George Washington, a man of pride and not a LYING scientist. Quote: “Government is like fire, a useful tool that must be controlled”. Kind of the opposite of that whole pro warming government is good and will protect you and take care of you and feed you and burp you and never tell you what to do, oh, unless they pass this pile of crap and ram it down your throat and then we will finally have the power to control you and NOT the other way around. That George Washington guy was from a different time, we’re progressives and we want to control, ooops almost let the truth out there, we want to help you to save the planet even though we have no control over it because God, not man created it. Think about that a government finally, finally, finally big enough to control absolutely everything you do. I think government has a God complex, but they’ll never be God, never.
First, I guess you would call me a “pro peer reviewed poster.” Please cite any evidence behind you claim that there is a universal conspiracy of 1000s of scientists to only fund climate studies that support global warming? On the contrary, if a scientist could posit and support an alternative hypothesis, it would be very much welcome in the peer reviewed research.
Second, I’m pretty sure everyone supports the evidence that the Earth is warming at the global level. The data is very clear. No educated person, not even an extreme conservative, who understands how to read data will disagree with that point. The debate is what is causing the warming trend.
Third, I respect your opinion on God. However, what if you are wrong. What if there is no God? What if there is a God who gave us the ability to understand that we are destroying the Earth and the free will to continue or to stop? Global warming is not a religious issue, it is a science issue. How to deal with it is apparently a political issue. I’m not sure why you chose to inject religion into the debate, but religion is based on faith. Faith has no empirical backing and is certainly not science.
Your humor in pointing out the ignoring data is spot on! Apparently there are many who’ve forgotten what they learned about proving theories. Forcing a favorable outcome to prove your theory is scientific heresy. Placement of measuring apparatus near over-heated areas on earth (asphalt, heat output, etc.) obviously adds to the temperature of the area, but not of the true heat of the atmosphere.
Iceland was warmer and Greenland was colder long before the industrial revolution.
Mother Nature will do what she will do, and those who think mankind is more powerful than nature are deluding themselves.
It all comes down to the old adage, “Follow the money”.
JoAnn, you can’t prove a theory, you can only disprove it. If you are going to post comments about science, you should first understand it. Theories evolve over time. Researchers create experiments with hypothesis. If the hypothesis are accepted, and if they support the theory, the theory becomes stronger. However, if only a SINGLE experiment disproves a theory, it can be instantly disregarded by science.
The people here, with this video, this debate, with politics in general is that people don’t really understand science. They think they do, but they don’t. Why? Our education system needs reform. People need to turn off the 24 hour talking point news channels and pick up a book.
Great videos:
This is not about Truth, this is about the Progressive Liberal Socialistic agenda, to destroy Capitalism, free thinkers (entrepreneur & free enterprise) to include manufactured goods (Factories, Business) lower & middle class citizens working and spending money.
The Progressive Liberal Socialistic agenda has force their rules and regulations on the Capitalistic markets (EPA) & (Cal/OSHA) now (Cap & Trade) ect, to outsource our jobs to foreign countries. They created (Entitlements), unemployment, welfare and now (Health care) add to the mix Immigration.
Truth, Faith, and honor are the only hope for Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Stealth Eagle, get brainwashed much? As a liberal, who is actually a supporter of free market, I think you are over simplifying just about EVERYTHING. I’m not sure how old you are, or whether you have read ANY history books, but there are reasons why we have the EPA and OSHA. It wasn’t like a bunch of bureaucrats were sitting around looking to gain more control and they thought up OSHA. You really should study how the EPA and OSHA came about. I’m not going to give you any help… WOW!
So you are against unemployment? Really? Seriously? Even during a recession? You think someone out of work for a few month should lose everything that they work their entire life for? Wow! So, if I did everything right, worked hard my entire life for 20 years, had a family, supported them, then I lose my job and can’t find work because there isn’t any work, I should lose my house? If that is the position of the Republican party, I’m glad I vote Independent / Democrat… Seriously.
Please define what you think is truth, faith, and honor. Sounds like a talking point without meaning.
I have a great life (family, job, house), liberty (I vote, I can speak freely), and the pursuit of happiness (I’m a doctoral student, I live in a great country, and I have tremendous potential in my job.) This was the same under Clinton, Bush, and now Obama.
Silly or not, science or not, mature or not, just some of the comments I saw above.
But one thing is for sure, if the envirowhackos through the congress are able to pass a law to remedy the fraud of global warming, we’ll all be paying.
You’ll be paying for your own CO2, you’ll pay again for the CO2 of the companies you buy products and food from, and you’ll pay the CO2 tax for all the “low income” people as well.
Just remember that when you think about supporting this law and the flawed science behind it.
The fact is Science has been politicized. I am an Environmental person but the Cap and Slave bill has it all wrong. READ THE BILL! Your electric bill will go up thousands of dollars per year. Guess what that means? NO JOBS! MORE POVERTY! Whether you agree with the science or not is your call. THere is NO EXCUSE for killing the economic situation of our country! Not to mention China will NEVER meet these requirements anyway so what’s the freakin point?
May, you are right on China. The problem with China is that they will continue to kill our country regardless. They have no labor rights, no pollution legislation, etc. It is our fault. Your fault and my fault. If we all stopped buy goods from China until they stepped up to meet our standards, we might have a chance. I can’t tell you how many high paying American engineering jobs I’ve seen go over seas. It is cheaper… China is a big problem for just about everything.
To play devil’s advocate, we can always say that somebody else won’t regulate CO2. Therefore, we shouldn’t either. There was a time when the USA was a leader. Maybe we can become that country again?
There is a lot of silliness on both sides of the “Global Warming” debate. I’m not an environmental scientist or a climatologist but I hope that my 25+ years in engineering has given me the ability to apply a little logic and common sense.
1. What is the difference between “global warming” and climate change? Global Warming is a phrase coined by pro-environmentalists with an agenda. Climate change simply describes earths natural cycle of rising and falling temperatures over a long period of time.
2. Is “global warming” man made? Extraordinarily doubtful. It is mans arrogance to believe that he controls or significantly contributes to changes in the earths climate. Consider the amount of ash and atmospheric pollutants released by a natural event….the recent volcanic eruption in Iceland.
3. Will cap and trade improve the earths climate? Of course not. It is simply a political posturing of a small number of folks who stand to become extraordinarily wealthy by pushing this charade of man made global warming.
4. Will cap and trade create jobs? No. Far more jobs will be lost than gained. Businesses will be burdened with huge fines, taxes and fees which will ultimately result in the loss of revenue and subsequent jobs. This is a serious consideration for all of you out there who still HAVE a job.
5. Should we ignore pollution? No. We should all be good stewards of the environment. Apply common sense.
Don’t be foolish and naive. It is ALL about money and power. Cap and Trade and this whole GW scam will personally affect your ability to work and support your family.
I agree 100% with Robosteve2002! I have been studying government for over 30 years and have uncovered 99.9% lies. The elite rich (banksters) have an iron grip control over government (sell-outs) globally and show no signs of releasing it! As far as showing proof Rambo, do the research yourself (as you stated to a previous poster). I got the sensation of broken record syndrome reading your posts telling everyone to provide evidence in support of their theories or claims. Follow the money! Those so called truthful climate scientists are the ones who are indirectly and/or directly working for big oil. They blatantly accuse the legit scientists that DO NOT WORK FOR THE GREEDY ELEITE of working for big oil themselves. What we can do is start our own business’s and boycott all products/services ran by the global elite! “This planet is going to shake man off its back like a bad case of fleas†– The Late George Carlin
Been reading these comments. Obvious Rambo is a paid to comment on this site. He’s posting every 37 seconds. It’s been a waste of my time.
I think we can all agree, we need to be good stewards of this planet.
I like the idea of doing controlled experiments.
What do you think would be the result of a higher concentration of CO2 gas in our atmosphere?
Here is a very interesting time-lapse video of a small-scale experiment that shows how it might impact plant life:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2qVNK6zFgE&feature=player_embedded
I’m sure you all remember what plants “breath” out, when they finish processing the CO2, right?
I believe we should all be responsible in the way we use the earth’s resources. That belief follows logically from my faith in God, the Creator, and the Bible as his inspired word to us. God gave us responsibility for being stewards over the earth.
What logical reason would someone have for intervening in the warming of the earth if life on earth began accidentally? (By the way, if we are the result of random chance, why is logic even relevant? On the other hand, if we were created by a supremely intelligent God, who set the entire universe in motion and created the marvelous balance we see in nature, then we have a reason to believe in rules of logic.)
And I’m not worried about the end of the world. It won’t be mankind’s pollution or CO2 that kills it. When man’s time on earth is up and everything that needs to be done here is completed, God will destroy it with fire, and then there will be a new, perfect world.
Meanwhile, we should all apply our God-given intelligence, led by His Spirit, to divide between truth and lies.
NO NO NO / what part of NO don’t you understand , You Obumer run the USA off china money Tax us with a new medical bill that will make many unhappy and you still can think of nothing but to destroy the USA , its a now drainer if you really care about something you work on it for FREE and that gos for all in DC if you love the USA and you see the money mess it is in ,If you really had Love action are needed . I have worked on some thing in my life I Love and not got payed . We are watching all of you and we can tell a man or a woman heart buy your words and your actions. Obumer you do not understand.
how could we ever forget Geri Halliwell of Spice Girls, they were very popular in the 90s..:”